Tony, I have a grad offer at IBM BCS and am hearing some terrible things about the company recently so wondered if you can shed some light on the issues I should consider when thinking about taking the job or not. I mean, IBM is a massive brand with good training and clients on their books but what should discourage me joining them specifically-does everyone know something I don't?Thanks in advance, your advice is much appreciated

The desperation in their latest advert shines through: the Other IBM indeed !!! IBM are simple hardware vendors and outsourcers: they’re not credible as professional management consultants which is why all the PwC people left as soon as they could.

What I'd say here is take everything you read with a pinch of salt. Disgruntled ex-employees are much more likely to post comments about a firm than current happy employees. That's just the way people are. I can think of many firms over the last years (Capgemini, PwC, IBM, PA all spring to mind) that have had bad stuff written about them in forums and discussion boards. Yet I know lots of consultants at all these firms that wouldn't swap their job for any other. So I guess I'm saying it's good to be aware of the problems that firms all have and to weigh these up in your decision, but it's rarely the case that the gripes you'll read of here are the general perceptions of everyone in the firm. The overriding consideration in my view is that you are going to get a great brand name on your CV and in a couple of years will be able to stay with the firm if you like it there - or move on to another plum role thanks to the strength of the brand on your CV. Hope that helps, Tony

Don't pay too much attention to the IBM brand: it can work for or or against you. What is more important to think about the sort of work you want to do. Do you want to be stuck on huge public sector assignments, in a company with a rather aggressive culture, or do you want to do more interesting work for a more people focussed company such as PA or Deloitte ? Within the consutling sphere, I'd also say that these firms have a stronger quality brand image than IBM too. You may also ask IBM to speak confidentially with your new colleagues before you sign up. That may inform your thought process too. By all means take the IBM job, but keep looking around until the day you join. Nightmare scenario is that you end up with nothing. No one here wants that for you. Best of luck with your decisions.

Thanks very much for your advice, I clearly have a couple of things to think about and didn't even consider a confidential chat with guys already working in BCS-good idea!I think I'll try and be reasonably transparent next time I meet them and ask them to explain why I'm hearing various gripes about the firm etc.. and what their opinion is on the situation. Combined with a chat with current consultants thats about as close as I'm going to get to reality I guess.Thanks for you thoughts, Grad

Don't forget to keep applying elsewhere too. Companies like PA or Deloitte are far better to work for. Much friendlier atmosphere, and better quality of work. Might be worth applying through their websites...

You may have missed some recent announcements regarding restructuring affecting IBM globally. Check out this news: http://news.zdnet.co.uk/hardware/0,39020351,39197311,00.htm Having had interviews with them in the past I personally think that they are would be a good organisation to work for. I think as Tony(Top Consultant) said that there will always be plenty of ex-employees grumbling about an ex-employers....Best of luck :)

Bearing in mind i don't really know what i want to do long term and am thus seeing consulting as the best way to get into seeing a variety of industries/sectors/functions etc....would a multi-disciplinary firm like Deloitte or Cap be better for me in the short term than IBM and the potential to be thrown into purely outsourcing etc....Cheers again, grad

Have you applied to PA, Grad ? They seem to get a lot of good press on here.

As yet, i haven't applied to PA or deloitte-my main reason being that they pigeon hole you into a service line from day 1 and i'm not sure that offers the scope and flexibility i'm after for the first two years. Am looking into them though and might drop them a line asking about the opportunities to have a secondment to another service line during analyst years etc...

Grad, I think you may be a bit confused. PA and Deloitte pigeon hole you?! if you think they do that, I hate to say it but wait till you get to IBM, then you'll know what a pigeon hole really is. PA and Deloitte as a thread has already mentioned are amongst the best people foucsed consulting firms to work for. PA in particular are very flexible, and one is certainly not pigeon holed. In fact there are vast opportunities for grads at PA. Opportunities that extend to working across service lines (within) reason if your skilled and yopu really want it. Both Deloitte and PA are meritocratic firms. I would def check them out. For me at least they would be heads and shoulders above IBM for a grad consultant looking for interesting projects and flexibility. If you want mundane, long term and rather boring work jump for IBM. As for brands, the IBM brand in consulting is not very credible. look in the Times and you cant help but laugh at their page spreads about the 'other IBM'. As a global tech/outsourcing firm, they are great and perhaps second only to accenture, but for true consulting that involves dynamic change, people interaction, analysis and critical thinking, they just dont compare to the above firms...well not yet anyway!

James, PA and Deloitte require you to join a service line from day one, whether it be Strat and OPs, BOP or Human Capital, there are streams as such whereby you are to a certain extent 'pigeon holed.' IBM, albeit a tech firm dont have that recruitment pattern, nor do Capgemini which is what really appeals to the likes of me-with little knowledge of where I want to be in five years time etc...I am obviously concerned I will be thrown out to a boring outsourcing role with IBM and do very little consulting per se, another aspect of deep blue to consider with regards to my application and potential job acceptance!Cheers

Grad, yu are right with respect to Capg, their CDC is good, and will provide you with a good induction into consultin. However you must be careful too. Yu will not spend sufficient time in all areas as yu seem to think to make an informed decision or gain enough experience for you too decide what you like. Yes PA and Deloitte ask you to pick a service line, but unofficially there is more flexibility, the service line is mainly done for reruitment purposes. Also yu work in cross service teams so you get to mingle, mi and see what other service lines are doing. I think your still to confused about what IBM will actually offer you. No amount of flexibility that you think you will get, and im telling you now you wont because business need comes before yours, will equip you with the skills you percieve to think you will get. IBM is a tech firm end off! PwC staff did not leave for no good reason. The culture there sucks and morale is low. Pay is very rigid and bonuses are nt great. At the end of the day ts your choice, and im not saying go to PA or Deloitte but i think you have been misadvised about IBM! All the best with your choices